| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | CafeTran and Java Thread poster: Olga GB
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Olga GB 
United States
Local time: 01:37
English to Spanish
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I downloaded CafeTran, but it says I need Java. I read so many warnings against the use of Java that I haven't decided to do it. There is even a site where they say that Oracle is thinking of replacing Java because of the many problems. Can somebody advise me in this question? (My laptop is Macbook Air). Thanks.
| | | | CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 10:37
| Don't give Java access to your browser | Jan 17, 2017 |
Java is safe as long as you:
- Keep it up to date:
- Don't give it access to your internet browser:
[Edited at 2017-01-17 06:48 GMT]
| | | | Olga GB
United States
Local time: 01:37
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Í Will have to find out | Jan 17, 2017 |
Thanks for your help.
As I don't have the experience, I will have to learn more about CafeTran before deciding to download Java.
| | | | CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 10:37
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MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 10:37
Italian to German
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| Hum...Keeping Java updated is a two-edged sword | Jan 17, 2017 |
Some people are working with older Trados versions. If you update Java then such CAT versions will not work any longer or you get in trouble soon. There are many similar examples also with non-CAT software.
Also Java is certainly not the fastest engine for a CAT tool that needs to work with increasing large databases.
For all its very good features, I highly wish CafeTran would run on a 'own' engine without Java ! My opinion about Java: it's just good to code some browser games...Le... See more Some people are working with older Trados versions. If you update Java then such CAT versions will not work any longer or you get in trouble soon. There are many similar examples also with non-CAT software.
Also Java is certainly not the fastest engine for a CAT tool that needs to work with increasing large databases.
For all its very good features, I highly wish CafeTran would run on a 'own' engine without Java ! My opinion about Java: it's just good to code some browser games...Let's play CafeTran? Hum...I'd rather like working with it.
Mike
[Edited at 2017-01-17 20:02 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Let's play CafeTran | Jan 18, 2017 |
MikeTrans wrote: Some people are working with older Trados versions.
The OP uses a Mac. Besides, under macOS (and probably under Windows), you can force a Java app to run under an older version of Java by launching it using a Terminal command.
Also Java is certainly not the fastest engine for a CAT tool that needs to work with increasing large databases.
But CafeTran is. Fast, I mean. If it's running too slow to your liking, you should first increase the Java heap in the CafeTran Preferences/Options. If it's still too slow - TMs of more than 200k segments, depending on your hardware - you can use Recall Memory from the Total Recall menu to "reduce" the database to only the segments relevant to the source document.
For all its very good features, I highly wish CafeTran would run on a 'own' engine without Java
One of those very good features is that it is cross-platform. And that more or less requires Java. And I don't have any problems with that. Been happily using CafeTran since 2010.
Let's play CafeTran
CafeTran is fun to use. Or so their ad claims...
Cheers,
Hans
| | | | CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 10:37
| MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 10:37
Italian to German
+ ...
| Hi CAfeTran Training, | Jan 18, 2017 |
sorry if I have made my reply of 'CafeTran and Java' look too comic, but I couldn't possibly resist. If your excellent CAT tool wasn't that good, I wouldn't have spent the time at all.
I understand your concern about portability, multi-platform compatibility, because you are selling your program, but I as a translator I don't care about that, what I want to see is getting the very complicated and intensive computation results from a CAT tool within not more than 3-5 seconds. For tha... See more sorry if I have made my reply of 'CafeTran and Java' look too comic, but I couldn't possibly resist. If your excellent CAT tool wasn't that good, I wouldn't have spent the time at all.
I understand your concern about portability, multi-platform compatibility, because you are selling your program, but I as a translator I don't care about that, what I want to see is getting the very complicated and intensive computation results from a CAT tool within not more than 3-5 seconds. For that, a programming language that best uses multithreading / Multi-core processing techniques is a must. SQL databases are an example, but not Java which is a highly object-oriented language that is, yes, convenient for coding, but only shows is best result in embedded environments like smartphones, tablets or other net-active usages. These apps are far away from effective computation processes that are best coded in other languages IMO.
But you are right of course, I always update my information, not only with Java. After reading the link below (it may not be the very recent one), my opinion for Java doesn't make a big leap I'm afraid.
http://www.embedded.com/design/programming-languages-and-tools/4438718/3/Programming-languages-for-multicore-systems-
Also I need to revise my opinion about the 'speed' of CafeTran on a newer version that I actually own, but I'm happy that you mention a SQL driver within your program.
Greetings,
Mike ▲ Collapse
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CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 10:37
| I don't sell any software | Jan 18, 2017 |
MikeTrans wrote:
I understand your concern about portability, multi-platform compatibility, because you are selling your program, but I as a translator I don't care about that, what I want to see is getting the very complicated and intensive computation results from a CAT tool within not more than 3-5 seconds.
I don't sell any software: I'm a freelance translator. These 3 to 5 seconds seem quite long for me as a CafeTran user. I'm happy to give you a demonstration via Skype or TeamViewer.
Load an XLIFF with 10,000 TUs both in Studio 2017 and in CafeTran 2017. Perform the following actions and let's see who wins:
1. Set all segments to 'Translated' or 'Checked'.
2. Replace 5000 times the word 'quality' in 8000 segments.
3. Perform a spellcheck when this project contains 20 unknown words (some correctly spelled, some not).
4. Empty all segments that contain a specific word.
| | | | MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 10:37
Italian to German
+ ...
| What about match querries, sub-segment match queries in real-time? | Jan 18, 2017 |
Ok, you are not selling, but then your avatar name implies that you are somehow related to CafeTran? Whatsoever, I think you understand that portability is not an argument for me, if I use Windows I'm not interested in Linux and vice-versa...
Operations like a real-time query of segment matches and especially sub-segment matches are much more intensive that the simple operations you mention (any text editors or similar apps could perform these instantly, that's not a good analogy). Just im... See more Ok, you are not selling, but then your avatar name implies that you are somehow related to CafeTran? Whatsoever, I think you understand that portability is not an argument for me, if I use Windows I'm not interested in Linux and vice-versa...
Operations like a real-time query of segment matches and especially sub-segment matches are much more intensive that the simple operations you mention (any text editors or similar apps could perform these instantly, that's not a good analogy). Just imagine a moment how long MemoQ would take if its routines were all written in Java? Maybe part of it is wirtten in Java, I don't know, but I don't think their LCS feature would yield results after 2 seconds on a 1.000.000 segment TM without a more advanced solution than Java. That's my point. Same goes for Trados Studio with its recent fragment feature (that takes too long to my taste with big TMs.)
In a remote version of CafeTran, I can see that sub-segments are searched in the background while processing other segments, a necessity, because it just takes too long with only a Java engine, I guess.
I'll be happy to see that this has changed in the 2017 version of CT, and I guess it's NOT because of Java, right?
Mike
[Edited at 2017-01-18 15:08 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | CafeTran Training (X)
Netherlands
Local time: 10:37
| What about match querries, sub-segment match queries in real-time? | Jan 18, 2017 |
MikeTrans wrote:
Operations like a real-time query of segment matches and especially sub-segment matches are much more intensive that the simple operations you mention (any text editors or similar apps could perform these instantly, that's not a good analogy).
These are not simple operations that I mention; it's not an analogy: it's the core of every day's translation tasks.
Sub-segment / fragment matching have been there in CafeTran since ages. Just like auto-complete that is updated on the fly and takes all resources into account.
So let us close this interesting debate with the conclusion: it's not the platform / programming language that matters but the talent of the programmer and the integration of the individual tasks (terminology, TMX editing etc.): integrated (CafeTran) versus modular (Studio, MultiTerm, SDLXLIFF Toolkit etc.).
| | | | MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 10:37
Italian to German
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| You are very abile in going around my points and arguments... | Jan 19, 2017 |
I wonder why...so, yes please, let's close the debate.
Greetings,
Mike
[Edited at 2017-01-19 01:34 GMT]
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Olga GB
United States
Local time: 01:37
English to Spanish
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TOPIC STARTER | All of this will help me | Jan 19, 2017 |
Thanks to all of you, there are things that I don't understand but as I will study the matter and go deeper in the use of CafeTrans, I am sure I will use this exchange for consultation.
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Olga GB wrote:
...I will study the matter and go deeper in the use of CafeTrans, I am sure I will use this exchange for consultation.
Please do.
Coincidentally, I installed macOS Sierra on a brand-new SSD last weekend. Since CafeTran is my main productivity app, I checked if Java was there by running the Terminal and entering
java -version
Version 1.6 was there. This proves Apple thinks Java is perfectly safe: They included it in their OS. However, since Oracle didn't update the Mac version fast enough for Apple, it's the last version they included. To check if a later version is there, go | System Preferences, and check if there's a steaming cup of coffee in the last block. If it's not there, download the latest version from java.com, click the coffee cup in the System Preference, and disable using it in the browser under Security | Enable Java content in the browser.
If everything works allright, there's no need to upgrade (especially not automatically), but you'll need at least Java SE/JRE 1.7 to make use of macOS' free dictation feature, available for numerous languages, including Spanish of course. The current Java build is 1.8.
Cheers,
Hans
| | | | Olga GB
United States
Local time: 01:37
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | A clear explanation | Jan 19, 2017 |
Thanks, Hans, for your explanation that is precisely what I needed. I will try then. There is still a problem according to what you explained and it is that I am in the beta program of the operative system, and it may happen that the Java last version is not updated for that. If you know something about this, I will be very thankful if you comment
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