| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17] > | Privatization of legal interpreting services in the UK Thread poster: Trans_Interp
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| I haven't and don't plan to | Apr 17, 2012 |
Jenny Forbes wrote:
Charlie, have you - or have any of the UK-based Prozians or interpreters in this thread - written to their MPs about this lamentable business? I suppose the protest demonstration means that MPs are aware of it, but ...
My MP is a Tory, although that said, she's relatively human, I've seen her in action at various public meetings over the years. But I don't see the point in writing to her. This is not a vote winning or losing issue. It's mainly an issue about fairness and justice and doing the right thing, and when push comes to shove, although I actually think she would probably be inclined to agree that the situation sucks for those caught up in it, she has no influence. She didn't go to Eton.
As I said just now, my belief is that there's only one thing that is going to influence any change of policy here, and that is hard cash.
| | | | Parrot 
Spain
Local time: 21:46
Spanish to English
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Charlie Bavington wrote:
I don't know whether I'm being cynical or just short-sighted or lacking imagination (and lacking any faith in the moral fibre of those running this circus)
Hope springs eternal, remember?
but this arrangement was bought in on cost grounds, and I think cost grounds will be the only thing that will see it ended. I don't think the MoJ really gives a stuff about any of the rest of it, otherwise they would have acted already. I'd like to think the drip, drip effect of the estimated costs of retrials and wasted court time we read in all the links here would be enough.
That -- and embarassment -- would seem to be working this side of the pond. (On the other hand, I hope I don't speak too soon).
Meanwhile... Thanks, Cecilia.
Anytime.
| | | | Ines Burrell
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:46
Member (2004)
English to Latvian
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| Neil Coffey
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:46
French to English
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| Pronunciation = basic requirement | Apr 17, 2012 |
LuciaC wrote:
I understood that the interpreter simply mispronounced the word. Speakers of Romance languages only know one way of pronouncing vowels and can found it hard to distinguish between short and long sounds (leek/lick, beach/bitch and many more).
The real problem was not the mistake, it was the fact that once she realized what she did, she kept quiet about it.
The latter is obviously inexcusable.
But the fact that the interpreter's pronunciation is so bad they they are unable to make a fundamental distinction between two English vowels in the first place also means that they simply don't meet one of the basic job requirements of being an interpreter.
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Rachel Fell
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:46
French to English
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Yes, I heard that earlier today in a news bulletin (am in UK) and thought  : he surely doesn't speak a rare language?!?
[Edited at 2012-04-17 19:07 GMT]
| | | | Giles Watson
Italy
Local time: 21:46
Italian to English
In memoriam | How hard is hard? | Apr 17, 2012 |
Charlie Bavington wrote:
As I said just now, my belief is that there's only one thing that is going to influence any change of policy here, and that is hard cash.
I'm not so sure.
If such manifest unfairness to non-English speaking defendants is allowed to go unchallenged, what's the point of being British?
On a more practical level, a half-decent PR campaign might convince the movers and shakers, who are unlovely but not stupid, that unless they do something sharpish, they are likely to lose electoral consensus.
And in any case, quantitative easing and sovereign debt haircuts have already deprived the readies of much of their carborundum factor 
| | | | | I'd like to hope you're right... | Apr 17, 2012 |
...but I rather fear you might not be, that's all. I'm just not sure that the rights of non-English speaking defendants, in particular, are that high a priority in terms of the wider electorate. A non-English speaking witness in a high-profile case might do it, perhaps. Or if m'learned friends start feeling the effects in their wallets (in addition to the waste we are already seeing), no doubt some more effective pressure might be brought to bear. Writing to influential MPs, why no... See more ...but I rather fear you might not be, that's all. I'm just not sure that the rights of non-English speaking defendants, in particular, are that high a priority in terms of the wider electorate. A non-English speaking witness in a high-profile case might do it, perhaps. Or if m'learned friends start feeling the effects in their wallets (in addition to the waste we are already seeing), no doubt some more effective pressure might be brought to bear. Writing to influential MPs, why not, what harm can it do? This govt can and does change its mind.
The sort of publicity we are seeing now can only be a good thing in terms of raising the profile of the issue, and linking that to the Olympic contract ought to help (I do think the powers that be are keen to see that event be a success in every possible way, including the country's image). I'm in no way advocating that people stop doing what they're doing, it can only help. I just think, sadly, that money will ultimately be the factor that swings the balance, barring a radical change in attitude. Perhaps this campaign (if that's what it is) will bring about such a change - but I'm not holding my breath. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Moving on... | Apr 18, 2012 |
I don't feel it is appropriate to share my political views here, however in the article I linked in yesterday, on Monday's demonstration by RPSIs: http://london.indymedia.org/articles/12086 (in my hurry, I forgot to remove the security encryption so it looked like a dodgy link) I addressed a number of the concerns mentioned here, the campaign started by several groups last month, including trad... See more I don't feel it is appropriate to share my political views here, however in the article I linked in yesterday, on Monday's demonstration by RPSIs: http://london.indymedia.org/articles/12086 (in my hurry, I forgot to remove the security encryption so it looked like a dodgy link) I addressed a number of the concerns mentioned here, the campaign started by several groups last month, including trade unions, and linked the issue into the larger malaise at the MoJ (sadly, linguists are not alone in this boat). I also mentioned the suggestions for action made by the MPs present.
The framework agreement is due for review at the end of this month and interpreters hope it is terminated thereafter. One of the things I did not mention, concerning the framework agreement, with respect to termination, is that the public authority (MoJ) can terminate it immediately in the case of default and with three months' written notice otherwise.
There were 200 people, mostly interpreters, at the event on Monday and they had travelled from all over the country. I am not a court interpreter myself or an RPSI (registered public service interpreter) but there is a serious issue of justice here. Apparently, there were more than 400 people at the demonstration last month (so I was told). Here are a couple of videos of that kindly forwarded to me by the organisers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zzb2kU8zkes (Andy Slaughter MP speaking)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ddn6lLLiog
May I also suggest that a visit to "interpretervids"' channel on that website may help to reduce some people's high blood pressure ... and provide an amusing break from work.
One final point I would like to make is that, as in all professions, good professionals are small in number and they will move on, which means that the longer it takes to sort this matter out, the more the problem will actually be perpetuated as once the situation is restored, there will still be a lack of good professional interpreters, as they'll have found other clients who appreciate their worth and skills more.
Aisha ▲ Collapse
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urbom
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:46
German to English
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| Item in Private Eye | Apr 19, 2012 |
There is an item on this in the new issue of Private Eye magazine (no. 1312). It's on page 5, i.e. the first page of news content in the mag.
Now that the Eye's favourite provider of outsourced public-sector services (the one they usually refer to as "Crapita") is involved, I think it's safe to say they will be keeping a close watch on how things develop.
| | | | | How did this come about in the first place? | Apr 20, 2012 |
Was there any public call for tenders on the part of the MOJ? How transparent was that exercise, if such a thing really happened?
I tried to get at the information from the earlier pages in this forum but I failed to find the same.
Please pardon me if this question is infructuous and the answer is already there in this fo... See more Was there any public call for tenders on the part of the MOJ? How transparent was that exercise, if such a thing really happened?
I tried to get at the information from the earlier pages in this forum but I failed to find the same.
Please pardon me if this question is infructuous and the answer is already there in this forum.
Please see http://www.linguistlounge.org/index.php/246-moj-fails-to-answer-freedom-of-information-requests-regarding-als-on-time
Regards,
N. Raghavan
[Edited at 2012-04-20 14:00 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | BeaDeer (X)
English to Slovenian
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| Will the new Directive have an impact on this matter? | May 5, 2012 |
http://www.eulita.eu/sites/default/files/directive_en.pdf and
The Directive is to be transposed into national legislations by 2013. Article 5, Quality of interpretation and translation says the EU countries must *take concrete measures* and "set up a register or registers of independent and ***appropriately qualified*** interpreters and translators.
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Parrot
Spain
Local time: 21:46
Spanish to English
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| Geoffrey Buckingham speaks at TRAFUT | Jun 16, 2012 |
TRAFUT -- Training for the Future -- is a series of EU workshops aimed at helping EU Member States get their acts together for the implementation of Directive 2010/64/EU. This Directive enjoins (orders?) Member States to: 1. provide T&I services to suspected or accused persons who do not speak or understand the language of the proceedings and 2. put together lists of qualified professionals to work in court so as to guarantee their fundamental rights. It automatically kicks off on 27 October 201... See more TRAFUT -- Training for the Future -- is a series of EU workshops aimed at helping EU Member States get their acts together for the implementation of Directive 2010/64/EU. This Directive enjoins (orders?) Member States to: 1. provide T&I services to suspected or accused persons who do not speak or understand the language of the proceedings and 2. put together lists of qualified professionals to work in court so as to guarantee their fundamental rights. It automatically kicks off on 27 October 2013 and is legally regarded as an "oblligation of best endeavour" (i.e., States can be fined in the ABSENCE of endeavour).
The first workshop of this series was held in Ljubliana, the second in Madrid, and the third was just held this week in Helsinki.
Here's the full text of Geoffrey Buckingham's presentation in behalf of APCI.
http://www.linguistlounge.org/images/Notes_for_TRAFUT_presentation_15_June_2012.pdf ▲ Collapse
| | | | BeaDeer (X)
English to Slovenian
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| That's the Directive | Jun 18, 2012 |
referred to in my previous post.
It appears to have arrived in the nick of time, too!
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