Spinster: term no longer used in the Registry Office? Can you corroborate? Thread poster: lafresita (X)
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lafresita (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:47
Polish to English
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Over 10 years ago, I answered a question about the word used for 'spinster' for a UK Marriage Certificate. The Polish asker was translating some documents that would be used in the Registry Office in the UK for a girl that had never been married before.
Please, see the answers below:... See more Over 10 years ago, I answered a question about the word used for 'spinster' for a UK Marriage Certificate. The Polish asker was translating some documents that would be used in the Registry Office in the UK for a girl that had never been married before.
Please, see the answers below:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/polish_to_english/law_general/671285-panna.html
My answer 'spinster' was chosen, as this term was used at the time. Can you corroborate that it was used at the time? Is it on your Marriage Certificate, if you were married at approximately that time or before that? In fact, if you want, can you also put your comments under my answer?
Well, over 10 years later another answerer tells me that on his Marriage Certificate it is written 'single'. Well, maybe it is, as the Legislation has gone through some changes since then, but that does not change the term that was used in 2004.
[Edited at 2014-11-25 15:04 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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From Wikipedia at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinster :
"The term once described any single woman. However, it has since evolved to only refer to older, unmarried women. As a result, in England and Wales, the term was abolished in favour of "single" for the purpose of marriage registration in 2005.[14]"
The reference at ... See more From Wikipedia at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinster :
"The term once described any single woman. However, it has since evolved to only refer to older, unmarried women. As a result, in England and Wales, the term was abolished in favour of "single" for the purpose of marriage registration in 2005.[14]"
The reference at [14] is to the following BBC article:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/4141996.stm
It seems that "spinster" was still in official use in some contexts in 1994, even though it was considered old-fashioned and even derogatory at the time.
(Edited to change the date from 1994 to 2004, in line with Miroslawa's edit.)
[Edited at 2014-11-25 17:41 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Inter-Tra 
Italy
Local time: 18:47
English to Italian
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Hahha aha..
This is hilarious )
Then we are all 'spinster'... should be actually 'unmarried' or 'single'
The explanation might be that in 'some legal contexts' the word is still in use.
Kindest Regards
Francesca
| | | | | I'm surprised... | Nov 25, 2014 |
that one of your references comes from The Guardian. That's the last place I'd expect to see the word used - their style guide says: "Avoid this old-fashioned term, which has acquired a pejorative tone; say, if relevant, that someone is an unmarried woman."
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lafresita (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:47
Polish to English
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TOPIC STARTER | Interesting article. | Nov 25, 2014 |
Thank you, John, for the link to the article. So, the term was changed for the Registry Office purposes at the end of 2005. But I still think, that Francesca is right. I think it is still used in some legal contexts.
| | | | lafresita (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:47
Polish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | 2004 and not 1994 | Nov 25, 2014 |
John Holland wrote:
It seems that "spinster" was still in official use in some contexts in 1994
I apologise. I meant 2004, when the question was asked, and not 1994...
[Edited at 2014-11-25 17:30 GMT]
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THIS is a perfect example of why I never claim to be able to translate into UK English.
I never would've guessed that the word "spinster" EVER had an official use!
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lafresita (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:47
Polish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Janet Rubin wrote: THIS is a perfect example of why I never claim to be able to translate into UK English. I never would've guessed that the word "spinster" EVER had an official use!
This is why many of my colleagues - many of whom are very accomplished translators - did not know what the word in use was in the UK, as you can see following this link:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/polish_to_english/law_general/671285-panna.html
| | | | neilmac
Spain
Local time: 18:47
Spanish to English
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| No longer current | Nov 25, 2014 |
The term is no longer common currency and should be finally laid to rest along with its 19th century overtones. The word will continue to exist in literature as a vestige of simpler? times.
| | | | B D Finch
France
Local time: 18:47
French to English
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| Earlier than that | Dec 5, 2014 |
neilmac wrote:
The term is no longer common currency and should be finally laid to rest along with its 19th century overtones. The word will continue to exist in literature as a vestige of simpler? times.
Not so much 19th century as 18th or medieval overtones. Once textile production moved to the dark, satanic mills, few unmarried women in Britain spent their days using a distaff or spinning wheel. Though this occupation has more recently been revived as a hobby, rather than a domestic duty. When did you last hear the expression "the distaff side of the family"?
Just a note to Miroslawa, any woman old enough to be married is not a "girl". Calling women "girls" can be as sexist as calling them "spinsters". I remember, a very long time ago, feeling outraged when my father referred to one of his aunts as an "old girl" because she had never been married, with the (intentional) implication that she had, therefore, never grown up.
| | | | Balasubramaniam L.
India
Local time: 22:17
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
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SITE LOCALIZER | The link with colonialism/imperialism | Dec 6, 2014 |
I think, the probable reason why the term "spinster" gained disproportionate significance in England during the 17th and 18th centuries could be that large numbers of English men were moving into the colonies in the US, Canada, India, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa, leaving an acute shortage of men in England, due to which many women there were doomed to a life of spinster-ship, as they could not find eligible men to pair up with. Thus in English society of those times, perhaps spinster... See more I think, the probable reason why the term "spinster" gained disproportionate significance in England during the 17th and 18th centuries could be that large numbers of English men were moving into the colonies in the US, Canada, India, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa, leaving an acute shortage of men in England, due to which many women there were doomed to a life of spinster-ship, as they could not find eligible men to pair up with. Thus in English society of those times, perhaps spinsters did constitute a significant and noticeable group in society, so much so that this term entered into literature and legalese there.
English novels of that period, particularly Jane Austen's (herself a spinster), are obsessively concerned about women's success in finding suitable husbands. Another celebrity spinster, albeit of more recent times, is Miss Marple, created by Agatha Christie. Her maiden name, significantly, is Jane. The fact that spinsters have such a prominent presence in English literature is perhaps indicative of their prominence in actual society too.
Also, during these two centuries and up to the two World Wars, large numbers of English men were getting killed in the never-ending wars in Europe and in the colonies, creating a further shortage of men, and increasing the likelihood of women remaining "spinsters".
I can testify in part to this hypothesis from the perspective of a country where these English men were pouring in in large numbers during those centuries. There are novels based on this side of the colonial-imperial divide, which deal with these "spinsters" pursuing the absconding/immigrating men to the shores of India in their bid to tie the knot with them. E M Forester's acclaimed novel "A Passage to India" immediately comes to mind in which one of the important characters is one such "spinster" English woman, Miss Adela Quested, who ends up accusing Dr. Aziz (another character in the novel and an Indian) of rape mostly because of the psychological trauma experienced by such women due to their unfulfilling single existence.
A possible way of verifying this hypothesis would be to examine how prominent the term for "spinster" is in other languages, particularly European languages, which were not involved in colonialism/imperialism to such an extent as England, for example, German. It is more than likely that in German the term "spinster" has no such disproportionate significance as in English.
I can at least certify for Hindi and other Indian languages I know of that no stigma or disrespect or social disapproval is associated with the equivalent of "spinster" in these languages, at least not to the extent it is in English.
[Edited at 2014-12-06 16:32 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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