Giusi Barbiani (asker): 5:54pm Aug 4, 2004: non male! - ciao greta,
mi sembra una buona pista, la tua. tutto sta nel capire fino a che punto posso spingermi con l'invenzione linguistica, ricorrendo a una corruzione inventata e non in uso. but there's food for thought, here! grazie mille davvero :-) e speriamo ci siano altre proposte che alimentino il dibattito! g Giusi Barbiani (asker): 8:27am Aug 5, 2004: Per Vittorio e Greta - Proposta diversa, quella di Vittorio (GRAZIE MILLE, by the way!). E in effetti, "angrez log", vuol dire proprio quello. Mi sorge un dubbio, però. Forse con "gente inglese" si perde la connotazione di lingua particolare, gergale, se non dialettale. Eppure nel testo si dice che "gente inglese" veniva usato dalla madre della famiglia per identificare tutti gli europei, quindi si recupera un po'... Ci devo riflettere ancora, anche in base ad altre occorrenze dello stesso termine molti capitoli più in avanti. Grazie, Vittorio! Scusate se non vi do risposte immediate. Ma è proprio quello di cui avevo bisogno: proposte che creino controproposte...
Cara Greta, temo proprio che non si possa lasciare "agrez". Sarebbe troppo estraniante, credo. :-) Giusi Barbiani (asker): 8:28am Aug 5, 2004: errata corrige - .. più avanti... ;-)
Erklärung: secondo me significa solo questo e non è un nomignolo. Segue...
The British had made it a point to ensure that the command of the Indian Army always stayed with them. The men were enrolled from certain classes called martial. Quite a large number of them were from the higher strata. They were given direct commissions as Jemadars and Risaldars and addressed as "Saheb". The Angrez Log were Sahebs and the rank with the prefix gave the Indian recipients a "British" sense of pride and status. In time to come they were promoted but had no authority. The senior-most of these with 30-35 years service were subordinate to the junior-most British officers. The British also downgraded the great traditional Indian army ranks. They downgraded the Senapati, commander of a large army, as Naik who commanded just ten jawans. For example, Dhokil Singh, later a General in the Sikh Army was a Drill Naik and Raja Bakhtawar Singh of Oudh a Havildar
da un articolo di reminoscenze durante il British Saj
South Asia English person: somebody who was born or raised in England ( informal )
[From Hindi, “Englishman”]
an•grez adjective
From Encarta Dictionary
yeh angrez log
by DillyDally
Posted on May 24, 2004 11:12 AM EST
Accessed 178 Times
Hot List Score: 74
u know how it is when u leave home and come abroad, searching for greener shores? well we all try to make do and u know, get along with the angrez folks but it doesnt always work though, does it?
i mean, i do hear from friends settled in US as well as reading the blogs of all u folks and reading between the lines, u do get along with your neighbours, don't u?
well, in my case, it is a no hoper. i live in merrie england and stiff upper lip is never stiffer than when i am around. all i have got in the past 3 years are hellos and how are yas, from one and all. at my son's playgroup, at the park, wherever u go, it is the same. one of my hubby's colleagues lives in the same complex as us but we don't even know his flat number!................
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 3 hrs 34 mins (2004-08-04 19:12:03 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
reminiscenze durante il British Raj (colonizzazione dell\'India)
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 20 hrs 43 mins (2004-08-05 12:21:22 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Giusi, non è gergale, è Hindi. Certo, lo usavano per tutti gli europei come in Italia si dice Inglesi per tutti i Britannici, con grande irritazione degli Scozzesi, Gallesi e Irlandesi che si ritengono popoli a parte.
Nel Medio Oriente al tempo delle crociate erano tutti Francs..ecc.
Erklärung: Ciao Giusi, Il link che ho inserito fa riferimento ad un forum di discussione su fonti sanscrite, in cui il termine “angrez” viene definito “a local corruption of the word "foreigner"… (for english)”. La traduzione che ti propongo non suona benissimo…ma se deve assomigliare ad una forma dialettale…è una proposta!! Perdonami, ma non mi viene in mente altro…;-))
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 14 hrs 6 mins (2004-08-05 05:43:57 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
L\'ipotesi di Vittorio è interessante, ma io continuo a pensare che sia un vocabolo leggermente dialettale...Domanda forse un po\' \"sciocca\"....non ti è possibile mantenere il termine in originale, ad es.: Gli \"anglez\" erano....
Erklärung: secondo me significa solo questo e non è un nomignolo. Segue...
The British had made it a point to ensure that the command of the Indian Army always stayed with them. The men were enrolled from certain classes called martial. Quite a large number of them were from the higher strata. They were given direct commissions as Jemadars and Risaldars and addressed as "Saheb". The Angrez Log were Sahebs and the rank with the prefix gave the Indian recipients a "British" sense of pride and status. In time to come they were promoted but had no authority. The senior-most of these with 30-35 years service were subordinate to the junior-most British officers. The British also downgraded the great traditional Indian army ranks. They downgraded the Senapati, commander of a large army, as Naik who commanded just ten jawans. For example, Dhokil Singh, later a General in the Sikh Army was a Drill Naik and Raja Bakhtawar Singh of Oudh a Havildar
da un articolo di reminoscenze durante il British Saj
South Asia English person: somebody who was born or raised in England ( informal )
[From Hindi, “Englishman”]
an•grez adjective
From Encarta Dictionary
yeh angrez log
by DillyDally
Posted on May 24, 2004 11:12 AM EST
Accessed 178 Times
Hot List Score: 74
u know how it is when u leave home and come abroad, searching for greener shores? well we all try to make do and u know, get along with the angrez folks but it doesnt always work though, does it?
i mean, i do hear from friends settled in US as well as reading the blogs of all u folks and reading between the lines, u do get along with your neighbours, don't u?
well, in my case, it is a no hoper. i live in merrie england and stiff upper lip is never stiffer than when i am around. all i have got in the past 3 years are hellos and how are yas, from one and all. at my son's playgroup, at the park, wherever u go, it is the same. one of my hubby's colleagues lives in the same complex as us but we don't even know his flat number!................
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 3 hrs 34 mins (2004-08-04 19:12:03 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
reminiscenze durante il British Raj (colonizzazione dell\'India)
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 20 hrs 43 mins (2004-08-05 12:21:22 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
Giusi, non è gergale, è Hindi. Certo, lo usavano per tutti gli europei come in Italia si dice Inglesi per tutti i Britannici, con grande irritazione degli Scozzesi, Gallesi e Irlandesi che si ritengono popoli a parte.
Nel Medio Oriente al tempo delle crociate erano tutti Francs..ecc.
Vittorio Preite Vereinigtes Königreich Muttersprache: Italienisch PRO-Punkte in Kategorie: 20
Hinweis von Fragesteller an den Antwortenden
Questa è la direzione giusta, ritengo. GRAZIE MILLE per l'aiuto! E buone cose, g :-)
The translation workplace 
