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Do agencies use bots?
Initiator des Themas: Emily Scott
Zea_Mays
Zea_Mays  Identity Verified
Italien
Local time: 10:48
Englisch > Deutsch
+ ...
business mentalities May 24

Baran Keki wrote:

I'm sure a deviously industrious individual taking the time and trouble to get himself registered to a first-come-first-served agency as a translator of dozen languages (by stealing other translators' resumes) will find a way to 'code a bot to claim jobs', which are then to be outsourced on Upwork to bottom-feeders at 1 cent per word.
If the agency 'take the complaints seriously' and is in need of 'finding ways to distribute jobs more fairly', why not do away with the idiotic practice of sending jobs on the "first-come-first-served" basis, and actually assign tasks to tried and true translators instead of taking absurd chances with dubious characters who got themselves registered there by clicking on the 'Join Us' button and completing (or rather having others complete) an easy, generic test translation?
Is it too much trouble for them to hire PMs who will personally deal with translators to assign them tasks? Does this scheme (automatically sending out job emails on the first-come-first-served basis) help agencies save money by not having to hire PMs? I mean what kind of effed up business mentality is this?

It is a genuine business mentality, aimed at efficiency.
We are talking about one project with dozens of language combinations and hundreds of thousands of words that need to be processed every day.
This agency is very meticulous when it comes to selecting translators, there is no "Join us" button, and there are many dedicated PMs for this project. Once you've passed their tests, you get a personal account and you'll work in a specific CAT tool, which requires an account linked to your personal agency account, and your work goes through quality checks, so even if someone without the necessary skills managed to get on board, they would be off-boarded quite quickly.
I think the scenario you describe could and probably does happen with less serious agencies (but what would be their long-term outlook?), but if designed and managed well, an auction system works pretty well for large amounts of content of the same type. Of course, it will not work for all types of projects.



[Bearbeitet am 2024-05-24 07:15 GMT]


Lieven Malaise
Yasutomo Kanazawa
 
Zea_Mays
Zea_Mays  Identity Verified
Italien
Local time: 10:48
Englisch > Deutsch
+ ...
job bots May 24

Dan Lucas wrote:

Zea_Mays wrote:
I think tech-savvy people would be able to code a bot to claim jobs for them.

That's what I would do. I would have a python script poll the server every few seconds, parse any new jobs, and grab anything with a volume or delivery date that I could handle. If it were only myself doing it I don't think there would be a problem and the agency probably wouldn't even notice. If lots of people were doing it then the impact on the server would probably be quite significant.

This might be what Emily has noticed.

Dan

That's interesting. So a script could act on such a platform with your ID?
You are right, the impact on the servers could be a serious problem if multiple bots are querying the system.


 
Baran Keki
Baran Keki  Identity Verified
Türkei
Local time: 12:48
Mitglied
Englisch > Türkisch
Doubt it May 24

Zea_Mays wrote:
It is a genuine business mentality, aimed at efficiency.
We are talking about one project with dozens of language combinations and hundreds of thousands of words that need to be processed every day.
This agency is very meticulous when it comes to selecting translators, there is no "Join us" button, and there are many dedicated PMs for this project. Once you've passed their tests, you get a personal account and you'll work in a specific CAT tool, which requires an account linked to your personal agency account, and your work goes through quality checks, so even if someone without the necessary skills managed to get on board, they would be off-boarded quite quickly.
I think the scenario you describe could and probably does happen with less serious agencies, but if designed and managed well, an auction system works pretty well for large amounts of content of the same type. Of course, it will not work for all types of projects.

Obviously I have no clue about the agency you're talking about and you seem to be very protective of them for reasons known to, and justified by, yourself.
But nothing can convince me that it's a "good and efficient business mentality" to assign jobs randomly on a first-come-first-served basis. As an agency, you must have your "go-to" translators with a proven track record who have consistently worked and delivered for some of your regular end clients. You just don't take a chance with another translator no matter how thoroughly they have been 'onboarded'. Of course, it goes without saying, you need to go to another translator when your 'go-to' translator is not available, but then you (as a PM) know that the second choice is also a good translator with whom you've worked in the past and see that they've delivered a number of projects for you over the years. A 'serious' agency works like this in my opinion.
Speaking of 'less serious agencies', it occurred to me that the agency the OP is referring to might be a certain French translation agency that has the word 'Master' included in its name, if that's the case, then they could be considered a 'serious enough' agency (owned by a multinational), and operating in the way I described. They don't seem to be doing well on the BB recently, and I'm willing to bet that they're not doing well businesswise either because of their 'egalitarian' distribution model.


Dan Lucas
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Chris Says Bye
Lingua 5B
 
Lieven Malaise
Lieven Malaise
Belgien
Local time: 10:48
Mitglied (2020)
Französisch > Niederländisch
+ ...
Yes, but... May 24

Baran Keki wrote:
But nothing can convince me that it's a "good and efficient business mentality" to assign jobs randomly on a first-come-first-served basis.


That's true, but there are agencies (I have one such client myself) that work this way, but without assigning jobs "randomly". They create pools of registrered and approved translators per client. So there's competition within that pool, but not with random people.


Zea_Mays
 
Gianni Pastore
Gianni Pastore  Identity Verified
Italien
Local time: 10:48
Mitglied (2007)
Englisch > Italienisch
A famous streaming platform… May 24

…I used to work for had (and I think still has) an immediate ban in place for those who use bots to harvest jobs. So, yes, it could very well be in your case.

 
100% May 24

Baran Keki wrote:
But nothing can convince me that it's a "good and efficient business mentality" to assign jobs randomly on a first-come-first-served basis. As an agency, you must have your "go-to" translators with a proven track record who have consistently worked and delivered for some of your regular end clients. You just don't take a chance with another translator no matter how thoroughly they have been 'onboarded'. Of course, it goes without saying, you need to go to another translator when your 'go-to' translator is not available, but then you (as a PM) know that the second choice is also a good translator with whom you've worked in the past and see that they've delivered a number of projects for you over the years. A 'serious' agency works like this in my opinion.


Yes. The idea that you can have a pool of translators who are all equally familiar with a client/subject is folly.

But, as you and I both know, Baran, a lot of pharma and finance translation is a box-ticking exercise where nobody ever reads what you produce, so the quality really doesn't matter. The first-come first-served model kinda makes sense then.

What beats me, though, is why so many established translators here continue to swim in that particular cesspit.* Similarly, everyone is always singing the praises of the Blue Board, but why would an established translator be continually scrabbling for work from dodgy-looking agencies and not rely mainly on a relatively steady flow of work from a handful of regular clients?

(*Yes, I did sometimes dip a toe myself because they paid me a fortune to do so, but now they've gone all MTPE so I'm out.)


Baran Keki
 
Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL
Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL  Identity Verified
Vereinigtes Königreich
Local time: 09:48
Englisch > Italienisch
Definitely bots... May 24

Lots of translators use them...

 
Philippe Noth
Philippe Noth  Identity Verified
Schweiz
Local time: 10:48
Mitglied (2015)
Deutsch > Französisch
+ ...
Like a Formula 1 crew member changing tyres May 24

Emily Gilby wrote:
One of the agencies I work for uses a portal system which releases jobs for translators to claim. When they release a job, you get an email notification with a link to take you to the job. For years, I'd have time to click on the link, look at the job details and consider whether I had the time to take it on before accepting or rejecting it. In the last couple of years however, now when I click on the link, even if I do it immediately as soon as I receive the email notification, the job has already been claimed.

I have experienced a similar trend with several agencies. Some of these agencies, I do not care at all. However, there is one particular agency/end client combo I really like to work for. So the geek in me had to setup a strategy to increase my chances of getting these jobs. Step #1 is to increase the mail server setting "Check for new messages every…". I am using Thunderbird as the mail client and changed that value from 10 minutes to 1 minute.

But yes, even waiting one minute is often too much. With my setup, I react in less than 5 seconds, and I cannot help feeling silly being like a Formula 1 crew member changing tyres. But I do get the jobs.

Since you cannot disclose the agency, feel free to msg me in private. If it is the same agency as the one I mentioned, I may have some additional tips like using the phone app and installing a click simulator on your phone to prevent the app or webpage session to time out. Crazy, I told you!

--
Philippe


Chris Says Bye
 
Emily Scott
Emily Scott  Identity Verified
Vereinigtes Königreich
Local time: 09:48
Mitglied (2018)
Französisch > Englisch
+ ...
THEMENSTARTER
. May 24

This is all very eye opening! Thank you everyone for your responses so far, very interesting…

 
Lingua 5B
Lingua 5B  Identity Verified
Bosnien und Herzegowina
Local time: 10:48
Mitglied (2009)
Englisch > Kroatisch
+ ...
Thanks May 24

Thanks to all the colleagues for disclosing all the tricks they are using and for reminding me once more why I am lucky and happy to stay away from such agencies. And finally explaining the 0.00001 second crowdsourcing mentality and what is actually happening.

And now some food for thought:

“One key area discussed was notifications received on devices and their impact. Phone notifications send our brains into overdrive and trigger the release of stress hormones like c
... See more
Thanks to all the colleagues for disclosing all the tricks they are using and for reminding me once more why I am lucky and happy to stay away from such agencies. And finally explaining the 0.00001 second crowdsourcing mentality and what is actually happening.

And now some food for thought:

“One key area discussed was notifications received on devices and their impact. Phone notifications send our brains into overdrive and trigger the release of stress hormones like cortisol. When we hear a notification sound or feel our phone vibrate, our brain interprets it as something that demands immediate attention. This can put us in a constant state of alertness, leading to heightened stress. Notifications trigger a release of dopamine, a neurotransmitter that can create a sense of anticipation and addiction, leading people to check their phones compulsively in anticipation of new notifications. This can lead to a sense of social pressure to always be connected and responsive.”

Source:

https://santamaria.wa.edu.au/notifications-and-our-brains/#:~:text=One%20key%20area%20discussed%20was%20notifications%20received%20on%20devices%20and%20their%20impact.&text=Phone%20notifications%20send%20our%20brains,something%20that%20demands%20immediate%20attention.

Now imagine what a 1 second notification/reaction does to you.
Collapse


 
Renate Radziwill-Rall
Renate Radziwill-Rall  Identity Verified
Frankreich
Local time: 10:48
Mitglied
Französisch > Deutsch
+ ...
Not familiar May 24

I am not familiar with this system of grabbing the job, and the faster you are, the more jobs you get. The companies publishing on proz are all waiting for your offer, CV etc. And then they choose, and I have no influence on this. Even if I am the first one to send my mail with CV, that does not mean, I get the job. Where am I wrong?

 
Lingua 5B
Lingua 5B  Identity Verified
Bosnien und Herzegowina
Local time: 10:48
Mitglied (2009)
Englisch > Kroatisch
+ ...
CV May 24

Renate Radziwill-Rall wrote:

I am not familiar with this system of grabbing the job, and the faster you are, the more jobs you get. The companies publishing on proz are all waiting for your offer, CV etc. And then they choose, and I have no influence on this. Even if I am the first one to send my mail with CV, that does not mean, I get the job. Where am I wrong?


Oh, that’s a different type of grabbing. CV grabbing. The more CVs a PM grabs, the higher bonus they get.


 
IrinaN
IrinaN
Vereinigte Staaten
Local time: 03:48
Englisch > Russisch
+ ...
I wonder May 28

How soon the question will read “Do bots use agencies?”

 
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